homeworks qsx vs qs

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Is QSX replacing QS processors or will they serve different purposes?

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Thread: Is QSX replacing QS processors or will they serve different purposes?

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I am very very confused about QSX. I've seen the little video and description of it along with most of the tech notes on the site and it seems like its main reason for existing is to allow for Ketra lights to be integrated with it which the existing QS processor apparently can't do. It also has cloud firmware upgrades. At first, this gives the impression that it can do everything QS can do plus the Ketra and cloud firmware stuff, but then when I read the fine print, it says that QSX can't work with RPM based systems so right off the bat, it's useless if upgrading old HWI systems, LiteTouch systems, along with every other RPM based QS systems. It has its own DIN rail type dimming module. So my questions for now is 1. Is QS being discontinued now or in the near future? 2. If you don't care about Ketra (and honestly I don't get why anybody should as it's proprietary and switches and your choice of lights work better ), is there any reason to get it over QS?

Yea its kind of stupid that it isnt backwards compatible. You would think in typical Lutron fashion they would at least offer to sell you a license to create a RPM link on the QSX processor to allow you to retrofit old jobs. I can see it already- just like HWI users that are hosed and need to redo most of their systems to QS when the old processor takes a crap, whats gonna happen when QS is discontinued and there is only QSX and they dont support RPMs and other QS devices? And if Ketra is their main selling point then im not too sure about that. We went thru the whole process of becoing a Ketra authorized design showroom (or whatever they call it), and honestly we havent sold a single system yet. Plus add to that the fixtures we installed in the showroom are now all of a sudden obsolete since they are using different RF technology now! Not a big deal with retrofit bulbs, but we have lot of the Ketra recessed lighting fixtures permanently installed in the ceiling. Oh and in our showroom we cant even go to QSX since our Ketra fixtures are the older ones and you cant just change out a part inside them to upgrade to the latest version! We already have one that has a problem and the whole fixture needs to be replaced! How does that go over with a homeowner that spent tens of thousands on a lighting system when you tell them you have to tear the ceiling apart??

For me it all depends on the price. If the P7 processor is 50% more because of Ketra it is a no-sale. Ketra is cool but I see it as something for the 1% of the 1%. I don't see it turning into another major product line like shades did. Unless of course, they can get the price way, way, way down. I did see where they said MI and Legacy links would not be supported at launch. That implies that they will be adding it, probably with a license fee as JOHNMAX noted. I would rather see them require a license fee to activate Ketra features. That would keep the base price of the processor down, keep compatibility, and I wouldn't have to pay for expensive features that I am never going to use (i.e. Ketra).

Convergence Technologies Raleigh, North Carolina www.convergenceusa.com

To clarify some of the questions in this thread, the QSX processor is the next generation version of the QS processor. It features increased processing power and memory that will allow Lutron to continue to deliver game changing innovations over the next decade. It was designed in a way to allow for an easy transition from QS to QSX and offers most of the same features as QS. All QS and QS wireless devices that work with QS processors also work with QSX, except for the Dynamic Keypad. QS processor databases can be upgraded to work with QSX processors. The QSX processor also has all the capabilities of the Connect Bridge, so that Connect Bridges are not required when working with QSX. A few features won’t make the initial launch. These exceptions are called out in the Design Guide that is available on myResources. Thanks to the ability to firmware update the processors through the cloud, many of these features will simply appear for homeowners without you needing to go back to site. It is true that only QS and QS wireless links will be available at launch. We can not yet comment on whether RPM or other legacy links will be available for QSX. It is recommended to keep systems with RPM and legacy links as QS for the time being. The same applies to LiteTouch and HWI upgrades. While there will be limited new development for QS processors, Lutron does not have any plans at this point to obsolete QS. We understand the amount of legacy systems deployed into homes and make every effort to support those customers for as long as possible. As for the price of the QSX processor, it will be slightly more than a QS processor, but less than the cost of a QS processor and a Connect Bridge. Because RPM will not be available, we also strongly recommend moving all new designs to DIN based panels so that they can be easily upgraded to QSX. The QSX processor has a counterpart, the Clear Connect Gateway with Type X technology, that supports the addition of Ketra as a native load in a HomeWorks system, but this part is only required for systems using Ketra. Please let us know if you have any further questions and we would be happy to help

Originally Posted by Aaron D. he same applies to LiteTouch and HWI upgrades. While there will be limited new development for QS processors, Lutron does not have any plans at this point to obsolete QS. We understand the amount of legacy systems deployed into homes and make every effort to support those customers for as long as possible. As for the price of the QSX processor, it will be slightly more than a QS processor, but less than the cost of a QS processor and a Connect Bridge. Because RPM will not be available, we also strongly recommend moving all new designs to DIN based panels so that they can be easily upgraded to QSX. The QSX processor has a counterpart, the Clear Connect Gateway with Type X technology, that supports the addition of Ketra as a native load in a HomeWorks system, but this part is only required for systems using Ketra. Please let us know if you have any further questions and we would be happy to help Thank you for clearing some things up. The reason I was asking was actually specifically because I am bidding a LiteTouch upgrade now and I want to be able to tell customer honestly that if they're going to spend all the money they really don't want to be spending right now (on the account of Savant's betrayal), that at least their system will be supported going forward and not treated the way Lutron treated Illuminations sytems - that is to tell customers that their less than 10 year old system that had failed needed to be upgraded to QS. Truthfully, I DO like the new DIN rail module because they don't need an expensive Module Interface, but if that's the way going forward, why doesn't Lutron have DIN panels? Is that something that's coming up or are we supposed to find our own panels and just mount DIN rails on them without UL approval? Anyway, I really hope you guys bring back the road-shows for existing dealers. Everything is so focused on trying to get new Pros to sell Caseta (system that I love BTW) so it's just getting hard to get correct information. This forum itself was down for a couple of days.

I agree about Ketra. If anything it's Ketra that's a super specialty product so I hope there will be support for RPMs and there is no license fee because RPMs are a current product and are a very big part of centralized systems that can't just be converted without spending 10's of thousands of dollars. Speaking of Ketra, for the life of me I can't see any benefit to them. For years Lutron was preaching that smart controls were better than smart bulbs and now they're pushing these smart bulbs? Even millionaires are smart enough to not buy a specialty light that only one place sells which may or may not be supported in 15 years.

SparkyCoog,Lutron does over some Din Rail panels.Feed through: http://www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocum...691055_ENG.pdf And breakered: http://www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocum...06_ENG.pdfHope this helps!

Got a couple questions- Saw this- *Note: Telnet is not a supported method of integration to a HomeWorks QSX system starting at HomeWorks version 16.0. Is there a new published API then? also, this is a bit of a bummer- 3. App Control of HVAC Lutron HVAC systems will not be controllable through the app. This feature can be automatically deployed to systems through the cloud once development is complete.

Originally Posted by weekscolin Got a couple questions-Saw this-*Note: Telnet is not a supported method of integration to a HomeWorks QSX system starting at HomeWorks version 16.0.Is there a new published API then?also, this is a bit of a bummer-3. App Control of HVACLutron HVAC systems will not be controllable through the app. This feature can be automatically deployed to systems through the cloud once development is complete. There is a new API used to integrate with QSX systems, however the protocol is not published at this time. Lutron is working directly with key integration partners to develop new drivers based on this protocol. Regarding control of HVAC from the app, while we can’t commit to a specific timeline, our engineering team will be working on rapidly filling out features like this following the release. As mentioned in the app note, features like this can be remotely deployed, delighting your customers with it post-launch / ongoing basis

Originally Posted by Aaron D. ...While there will be limited new development for QS processors, Lutron does not have any plans at this point to obsolete QS. We understand the amount of legacy systems deployed into homes and make every effort to support those customers for as long as possible... History disagrees with you. I started installing HomeWorks Original. Within a year of the release of each new processor, the previous generation was obsoleted. Sometimes within a few months. Considering Lutron left out critical features like RPMs and Telnet, it might take a little longer to obsolete the P6 processor.

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Upgrading to Lutron Homeworks QS or QSX

Why upgrade your homeworks interactive or illumination lighting control system.

Lutron Homeworks Interactive was launched in the year 2000, and Homeworks Illumination in 2005.  These systems were designed to control the light sources used at that time: incandescent, halogen, low voltage tungsten halogen, low voltage Xenon, Cold cathode.  Many of these light sources are no longer in use due to obsolescence and newer more efficient LED technology taking its place.

To reduce energy consumption the UK Government have prohibited the manufacture of halogen lamps.   When compared to LED technology, halogen bulbs are inefficient, use more energy and reach high temperatures. Although replacing halogen lamps with LED lamps may seem like a simple task, using LED lamps on a lighting control system that is designed for dimming halogen light lamps, can cause a multitude of problems, such as flicker and not being able to turn lights off reliably.

The reason why your Lutron Homeworks Interactive or Illumination (or other brand of control system) for example, may not work with LED light fixtures, is because the phase dimmers used on older lighting control systems are different to the ones used in newer lighting control systems such as Lutron Homeworks QS and Lutron Homeworks QSX .

There are two types of phase dimmers commonly used:

• Leading edge - traditionally used to dim halogen lamps
• Trailing edge – now used to dim LED’s

Typical Homeworks Interactive/Illumination lighting control panels (with covers removed)

Older lighting control systems such as Lutron Homeworks Interactive and Illumination used leading edge dimming modules such as HW-RPM-4U-230-CE, HW-RPM-4A-230-CE, HWI-WPM-6D-230CE which are not compatible with LED fittings and lamps. LED’s require trailing edge dimming modules which are designed for lower power lighting loads.

The Lutron Homeworks QS and Lutron Homeworks QSX systems have been designed to control LED with trailing edge dimming, so if you are considering replacing halogen light fittings with LED, to reduce energy consumption and improve performance, you will find that an upgrade will be needed.

Beside the issue with incompatibility, there can also be difficulties with supporting Homeworks Interactive and Illumination. For example, if your Lutron Homeworks Interactive or Illumination Processor fails, there is no way to extract the data from it. These processors are obsolete and so an emergency upgrade to Homeworks QS or QSX would be needed.

To avoid these situations, we highly recommend, being aware of the solutions in advance and factor this in with your timescale and budget when considering a Lutron upgrade. It may be that only certain components require upgrading, if you would like to keep your keypads that you are already familiar with. We can also carry out a phased upgrade plan, if you have ongoing refurbishment plans for example. Upgrading your Lutron system will run a lot smoother and simpler if we are able to extract the code from the existing processor.  

Benefits of upgrading:

Upgrading to the latest generation of Lutron lighting control will provide excellent performance and reliability and advanced range of integration opportunities.

Performance

The Lutron Homeworks QS or QSX system will allow you dim LEDs to their optimum performance using the 4A5 Pro LED+ Phase Adaptive Dimmer Modules . For enhanced performance, dimming protocols such as 0-10V and DALI can be used which can offer superior dimming of LED’s and allow colour tunable / tunable white (via DALI Type 6 (DT6) or DALI Type 8 (DT8)) LED’s to be used.  For areas where colour changing, or dynamic control is needed, the DMX protocol can be used.

Keypad Flexibility

Lutron have a wide range of elegant keypads including Allisse and Palladiom , International See touch and wireless Pico in a variety of finishes to match your aesthetic as well as an option for you keep your existing keypads.

Automated Blinds

Control the brilliant range of motorised blind options from Lutron including Roller Blinds , Wood Blinds , Honeycomb Blinds and Horizontal Sheer Blinds . Ultra-quiet and battery powered are suited to fit a variety of window treatments. Existing Lutron QED and third party curtains and blinds can also be incorporated into an upgraded system.

Control from anywhere

With the Lutron App you can control lights, shades, from anywhere in the world. You can also make changes to pre-set lighting scenes to your requirements eliminating the need to call out an engineer when you want to make changes.

Integration

The Lutron Homeworks QS and QSX allows you to integrate Amazon Alexa, Apple HomeKit, Google Assistant and Sonos seamlessly, a great solution for people who require the advantages of technology assisted living. Integration via Telnet to legacy third party systems is possible with Homeworks QS .  LEAP Integration is available with Homeworks QSX .

Our process to upgrade would include:

• A preliminary discussion to discuss the project, your priorities, phasing and timescale.
• A detailed survey to record the lighting circuits, extract the system code if the processor is still online and take note of the keypad functionality.
• Provide a proposal with cost options for a full or partial upgrade including dimming modules and keypads.
• After confirmation on the project proposal we will produce a lighting control schematic, we will proceed with ordering the equipment and preparing and testing as such as possible offsite. This will minimise downtime and disruption whilst the system is changed over.
• If there are new keypads, we would discuss and agree on any engraving with you.
• Once we have built and prepared the new equipment, we will arrange for a delivery date. All items are packed logical order for ease of installation on site.
• We would arrange a convenient time where the system can be taken off line whilst the new one is installed.
• Once completed and programmed, we will check everything works as intended, and introduce you to the Lutron app, showing you how to make simple adjustments.

There are many benefits in upgrading to a Lutron Homeworks QSX system, so if you find yourselves in a similar position where you would like to change from Halogen to LED or if you are concerned that your system may need upgrading in the near future, please do not hesitate to contact us.

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